Jocko Podcast 98 - Dr. Jordan Peterson

[mynewunit]

Podcast 98 Page

0:00:00 – Opening

0:21:27 – Who becomes evil? And Why?

0:31:59 – Taking ultimate responsibility.

0:41:43 – Dangerous but disciplined.

0:59:40 – Discipline and kids psychology.

1:05:08 – How to be successful. Breaking the loop.

2:04:42 – Self Authoring.

2:34:36 – Determining personality traits.

2:53:35 – The rise of Jordan Peterson.

3:00:29 – Using praise and rewards carefully. Participation trophies?

3:13:25 – Support JockoStore stuff, Super Krill Oil and Joint Warfare, Origin Brand Apparel, with Jocko White Tea and Psychological Warfare (on iTunes). Extreme Ownership (book), The Discipline Equals Freedom Field Manual.

3:41:39 – Closing Gratitude.

[Gavin]

I’m a new listener to your podcast. I didn’t know who you were until I heard you on the Tim Ferriss show, and I enjoyed the episode, so I decided to subscribe. The first episode that I heard was your episode on darkness, with Dr. Peterson as a guest. While I disagreed with some of Dr. Peteron’s ideas, overall I found the episode highly engaging and interesting.

One point that he made however struck me and compelled me to write this message: his very, very brief discussion on feminism. He described feminism as something that is taken up by “mostly damaged women” who have “never had good relationships” with men, and who confused power and dominance with competence.

There are a multitude of flaws in this argument. First of all, feminism is not something only taken up by “damaged women” who have never had “good relationships with men.” Describing them in such a way is dismissive, narrow-minded and sexist. Can he point to any empirical evidence that actually supports his claim? There is an abundance of literature that would point the other way.

Second, to argue that we confuse “competence” with power/oppression etc. also conveys a very, very limited perspective – I would like to challenge him by questioning what defines “competence,” and on what basis is that determined? Many have argued that our society is structured in such a way that it primarily recognizes male competence: traditionally “female” skills are often devalued, and then when women attempt to adopt “male” skills, they are often ostracized. Certain actions – asking for a raise, for example – are perceived differently based on whether the person is male or female. For men, it is something respectable. Women are attacked for being “domineering,” “pushy,” what have you. Then when they do not stand up and ask for the same treatment, they are similarly punished. It is a damned-if-you-do, damned-if-you don’t situation. There are plenty of studies that document this. To dismiss feminist arguments in this realm as being completely misguided is…well, it is itself completely misguided.

I think there is a lot of value in taking responsibility for your actions, but I also believe that there are some situations in which your actions have limited effects, and more powerful change can be effected, not by “changing the nature of reality,” as Dr. Peterson would say, but by pushing for change on the larger political, economic, and social structures which perpetuate them.

That said, I still really enjoyed the episode. I look forward to hearing more of your podcast.

[mynewunit]

Hey Gavin,
Not intending to speak for Jocko or Dr. Peterson. I think you are making an assumption about what male behavior Jordan "allows". I think his story about his wife feeding the visiting boy shows his awe and appreciation for women. I don't get the impression that Jordan is out justifying the gender pay gap. I think he is against women who take legal action because there are not enough women welders.

I agree a lot of the problem with the gender inequality is a lot of men don't appreciate skills seen as feminine. Sometimes they don't translate to invoicing, but they do serve office morale and team mentality. Obviously, it is a complicated issue. Glad you felt inclined to share.